Demo Crashes - Does the Steam also?

[WolveNZ]

Hi,

Ive downloaded the demo of GearCity, everything goes pretty smoothly - can design chassis/engine/gearbox/vehicles.

But, thats about it, normally the game crashes when I click on something normal, but ive never gotten any further.

The question is, is the steam early access more stable than the demo?

Running Windows 10 if that means anything

[Eric.B]

I'll need your log file to determine why you crash. Most likely, being Windows 10, you have driver issues effecting the game.

To get the logfile, go to where you installed the game, click GearCity folder, and the logfile is named logfile.log. Attach it to a post in this thread. (EDIT: Note, you must get the log file after you crash, don't open the game again before you send me the logfile, as the data will be overwritten.)

As for the answer to your original question. It depends on why you're crashing. The Steam version is further along than Open Beta, however most cases of crashing are user hardware/configuration issues and not necessarily the game. Some of these I can fix, some of these I can't until the drivers are fixed. There was some fixes to Windows 10 support in our "Testing" branch on Steam. But it is unknown if this resolve driver issues some people are having with Windows 10 installs.

[Thor446]

I'm having a similar issue, I just switched steam over to the 1.18.6 beta, and the game is crashing now, it never has before. I just installed the new AMD Crimson update, so it's entirely possible it's that, but here's my log file anyway;

https://www.dropbox.com/s/lxtfvo5wr9a9xc...e.log?dl=0

EDIT:

Here's another
https://www.dropbox.com/s/tcnixzhd9ndqvq...2.log?dl=0

[Eric.B]

I'm having a similar issue, I just switched steam over to the 1.18.6 beta, and the game is crashing now, it never has before. I just installed the new AMD Crimson update, so it's entirely possible it's that, but here's my log file anyway;

https://www.dropbox.com/s/lxtfvo5wr9a9xc...e.log?dl=0

EDIT:

Here's another
https://www.dropbox.com/s/tcnixzhd9ndqvq...2.log?dl=0

That's an odd one, as the logs aren't showing anything, it just abruptly stops.

Could you verify the game cache in Steam? Also clear out the cached Shaders (same folder as the logs, Cache Folder, delete everything in there.)

If you switched back to default build (1.18.4), does it work fine? (Testing build should be 1.18.7, if it says 1.18.6, then verifying the game cache in steam will probably fix it.)

EDIT: Forgot to add, if it keeps crashing, try switching over to OpenGL. See if that improves stability.

[Thor446]

I'll give it all a try and get back to you.

EDIT: Verified cache, it downloaded 1 file, switched to OpenGL, Ill try this out.

[Eric.B]

It wouldn't happen to be a Windows 10 machine would it?
We've also had a number of issues with older AMD's on Win10 as well. My hunch is driver issues all around. Sadly none of my hardware works with Crimson drivers. Actually, I take that back, my laptop might. I'll check that out tomorrow.

Anyhoo, going to sleep. I'll check back first thing in the morning.

[Thor446]

Nope, Windows 7 with an R9 290x, just got the brand new Crimson drivers today.

So far it's going good, no crashes. Though one thing has been driving me insane, is the track Burdal- Vannliljen taken right off Runescape? I'm pretty sure it sounds like it.

EDIT:
Spoke too soon
https://www.dropbox.com/s/oprx9yd3m0zejo...3.log?dl=0

Looks like it just ends abruptly this time, too. I'll switch back to 1.18.4 to test that out.

EDIT 2: After a while of playing 1.18, no crash yet. If I may also make a suggestion, I definitely like the end turn system better in 1.18.4, I can just spam the end key and it just goes right to however many months I need, whereas in 1.18.7, it opens the big wikipedia thing and takes a lot longer that way.

[Eric.B]

So far it's going good, no crashes. Though one thing has been driving me insane, is the track Burdal- Vannliljen taken right off Runescape? I'm pretty sure it sounds like it.

I doubt she (Burdal) ever played Runescape. All the music in the game should be original work.

After a while of playing 1.18, no crash yet.

That's really odd. Because 1.18 uses an older version of the rendering system which shouldn't be more stable.

From what I'm seeing on Reddit, there are a lot of issues with the Crimson drivers. So we might have to wait for a few updates on their end to fix this issue.

If I may also make a suggestion, I definitely like the end turn system better in 1.18.4, I can just spam the end key and it just goes right to however many months I need, whereas in 1.18.7, it opens the big wikipedia thing and takes a lot longer that way.

Actually the speed of opening up the DYK is unnoticeable different, the problem with "speed" is I forgot to turn debugging timer off, which is why the log files are so big with lots of numbers.

The reason for needing this system is Windows 8 and newer. They clear out the video (thus showing a black screen) then pop-up the "This program is not responding" screen even though the turns are just calculating in the background. So I have to do something to prevent this from happening. Thus the did you know screen.

[Thor446]

I doubt she (Burdal) ever played Runescape. All the music in the game should be original work.

Her songs in the game are somehow pulling up nostalgic memories for me of Runescape, the styles are so similar.

That's really odd. Because 1.18 uses an older version of the rendering system which shouldn't be more stable.

From what I'm seeing on Reddit, there are a lot of issues with the Crimson drivers. So we might have to wait for a few updates on their end to fix this issue.

I just looked up the issues too, seems like there's way too many. I haven't had any so far, with the exception of this crashing.

Actually the speed of opening up the DYK is unnoticeable different, the problem with "speed" is I forgot to turn debugging timer off, which is why the log files are so big with lots of numbers.

The reason for needing this system is Windows 8 and newer. They clear out the video (thus showing a black screen) then pop-up the "This program is not responding" screen even though the turns are just calculating in the background. So I have to do something to prevent this from happening. Thus the did you know screen.

I know it did go not responding if I spammed the button, but I mean, I used to be able to spam the End key and it would crash like that, but then it returns with 10 or so turns done. Now, its done 1 by 1.

[Eric.B]

I doubt she (Burdal) ever played Runescape. All the music in the game should be original work.

Her songs in the game are somehow pulling up nostalgic memories for me of Runescape, the styles are so similar.

Well, she's much better at RPG type music than business sim music, if you're interested in her work: https://soundcloud.com/kristinburdal

That's really odd. Because 1.18 uses an older version of the rendering system which shouldn't be more stable.

From what I'm seeing on Reddit, there are a lot of issues with the Crimson drivers. So we might have to wait for a few updates on their end to fix this issue.

I just looked up the issues too, seems like there's way too many. I haven't had any so far, with the exception of this crashing.

Drivers are a bit unpredictable, specially when it comes to issues with smaller games like ours. I don't think DirectX 9 is much in the focus right now for AMD with all the other issues they're having.

Still, I find it odd that 1.18.4 is working better than 1.18.7. You wouldn't happen to own Torchlight or Running With Guns would you? They share a similar rendering system (Ogre3d.) with ours. That would quickly narrow down if it's me or them (AMD) Although I still side that it's AMD issue right now.

In any event, from what I read, there is a hotfix coming out tomorrow (15.11.2) and another driver due in December. In that month GC 1.19 will be out, so if we still have this issue after those two updates let me know and I'll see if I can get a hold of anyone at AMD.

I know it did go not responding if I spammed the button, but I mean, I used to be able to spam the End key and it would crash like that, but then it returns with 10 or so turns done. Now, its done 1 by 1.

Well it never really "Crashed" it's just the game is running on a single thread, so when it's calculating it wasn't updating the window or anything else, it was just crunching numbers. So windows assumed that it "Crashed" when it was perfectly doing what it's supposed to. (The game is developed in XP64, so I don't get these sort of messages, never knew about them until I got a windows 8 laptop.) The DYK screen should end those messages (Which may improve my "Game always crashes" negative reviews... (Although some of those are not updated intel drivers... *sighs at the third party code I rely on.*)

As for the the spamming the button 10 times. This is because the game has buffered input. So it would save the number of times you hit end. Before DYK, the end turn stuff didn't take any input in. So it wouldn't pull the next key you pressed until it was back in the office. (Thus allowing you to spam end key.) Now the end turn stuff takes in input, so people can prematurely pause multiple turn simulations. Thus additional "end" key presses you take are discarded.

So brings up the dilemma. The DYK system has had some good feedback and being able to stop simulations of multiple turns was a requested feature by a few people. So cutting out that system is probably not an option.

Injecting more "End" keys during DYK screen technically would be difficult as well. As the system only looks for key presses 20 times during the number crunching. So if you don't hold down the button at the right time, it won't be read. (Thus why I say hold down the button to pause the simulation.)

What could most likely happen is hitting the end key in the office will bring up the end turn menu allowing you to select how many turns to simulate. Does take a little extra time. But it's about the best I can do while fixing the above issues.

[Thor446]

Holy crap, she's good at making music.

I don't own Torchlight or RWG, but I would agree that AMD is the issue. I'll let you know what happens after the hotfix.

The DYK menu does end the crash notices, but it kind of seems silly to have a wall of text pop up for a second, so you can't even read it. Building on that, do you think you could make it pause on the DYK menu, so that you would have to hit enter or "next" or another button to make it go away? Kind of like how Democracy 3 ends the turn, then shows a quote that you have to hit enter to return to the game.

[Thor446]

Update, it appears it didn't switch into OpenGL when I told it to, but now I'm playing in OpenGL and I haven't had a crash for hours now.

[Eric.B]

Holy crap, she's good at making music.

And she keeps getting better. But her style doesn't really mesh well with this game. Hopefully we can use some of her work again in the future for different projects!

I'll let you know what happens after the hotfix.

I believe the hotfix is for fans. Seems like fan control is broken on some cards.

The DYK menu does end the crash notices, but it kind of seems silly to have a wall of text pop up for a second, so you can't even read it. Building on that, do you think you could make it pause on the DYK menu, so that you would have to hit enter or "next" or another button to make it go away? Kind of like how Democracy 3 ends the turn, then shows a quote that you have to hit enter to return to the game.

I'm not sure if it was implemented in 1.18.7 or after, but you can keep the DYK window open after simming a turn. When you open up the end turn menu there is a check box to keep that window open.


That being said, the longer you play the game (and the crapper CPU you have) the more time you have to read them. With both my laptop and the windows dev machine, I can read the dyk's after a few years of gameplay with full AI.

Update, it appears it didn't switch into OpenGL when I told it to, but now I'm playing in OpenGL and I haven't had a crash for hours now.

Good to hear! Then yes, its driver issue and not the game. You have to hit apply and restart the game for settings to save.

In anyevent, when you get updates from AMD, try out the game in directx and see if you still crash, since the directx looks a little prettier than our opengl port.

[FruLuna]

Holy crap, she's good at making music.

Thank you! I can confirm that I have not played Runescape, so the music sounding like that was not on purpose.

[Thor446]

And she keeps getting better. But her style doesn't really mesh well with this game. Hopefully we can use some of her work again in the future for different projects!

I think it does fit in very well, actually. Her music really gives the feeling of a 20s style movie or tycoon game. I can't explain it, but it does make it feel more like a fast paced business environment in the golden age of America.

I believe the hotfix is for fans. Seems like fan control is broken on some cards.

Ah yeah, I should probably google these things first. Luckily I didn't have that issue.

I'm not sure if it was implemented in 1.18.7 or after, but you can keep the DYK window open after simming a turn. When you open up the end turn menu there is a check box to keep that window open.

Yeah, that was 1.18.7. I'm just trying to find a way to be even lazier, so that works too.

Good to hear! Then yes, its driver issue and not the game. You have to hit apply and restart the game for settings to save.

In anyevent, when you get updates from AMD, try out the game in directx and see if you still crash, since the directx looks a little prettier than our opengl port.

I did restart it, but somehow it didn't register it, but all is well now. As soon as they release better drivers, I'll be right back here to let you know how it goes.

But definitely keep it up, this is by far the best tycoon game I've ever played, and I can't wait to see where it goes from here. I do like Automation's more advanced designing of parts, but that's about all it has going for it, whereas GC is still in depth, and even funner.

Though I do have yet another suggestion, engine reliability. Do reliability ratings go up over time? So a V8 in 1910 is far less reliable than a V8 in 1990? If yes, that would explain it, but if not, I think certain engines could do with a shakeup of the ratings. The engine in my F-150 (a 5.4L V8) has won awards for being one of the most reliable, long lasting engines ever, and mine personally has given me quite a bit of work out of it. But when I re-make it ingame, it somehow only gets like a 3.5 star reliability rating.

Thank you! I can confirm that I have not played Runescape, so the music sounding like that was not on purpose.

It's a good thing, Runescape was basically my entire childhood. You music somehow brings up my nostalgia, despite it being different songs, and an entirely different game.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4M4XTsx...6E&index=4

If you listened through this playlist, you can definitely see the similar style. There's a few songs that I have in mind that I can't quite put my finger on, but a good 2-3 of your songs sound exactly like songs that played in locations that I spent most of my time on that game on.

I listened through your soundcloud, and you do make some pretty good songs

[Thor446]

Uh oh, it happened again

https://www.dropbox.com/s/krby2g4ix16sat...e.txt?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ancfox7u8cu7jr...4.log?dl=0

Appears to be something wrong with the GUI or something. I just made 3 trucks, went back to the office, built a new factory, then hit End, and it just died.

[Eric.B]

The first one shows that it crashed inside libgui, but that's just where the crash finished at. This: Exception Code: c0000005 shows that the memory stack was blown, so the actual crash was between clicking the mouse and after all the events are finished for clicking the mouse. When you change "rooms" the click happens, it loads the rooms, renders once, and then the click is "finished"

In the logfile, the "Made It" happens when you get to the first rendering inside the office. So the crash isn't in the GUI, but rather rendering something blew the memory stack causing the rest of the program to forget where variables are stored, thus crashed with c0000005 inside quickgui when it tried to use a variable.

So in short, still probably driver issues.

If QuickGUI was the issue, it would throw an exception in the logfiles or have the same issue all the time.

[Thor446]

Pretty much what happened is I clicked on the office button, then I guess it froze for a second to load, and I clicked again, which caused the crash, as usual with windows. I was hoping there was a way to fix that freezing, but I guess it's just the game being slow or something?

[Eric.B]

I'm not sure why you would get lag there... My computer is quite a bit older (A 2008, Phenom 9550...) and the only place I have any noticeable lag is going to RnD.

Anyhoo, I've been fiddling around with a similar bug today, it may fix clicking crash you have assuming it's related and not a driver issue.

[Thor446]

I have a FX-6200, so it shouldn't be doing that, but it might be a windows 7 thing to freeze up like that.